Thembos ahoy! What is your view of yourself like?

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15.04.2020
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Reasonopia
15.04.2020 20:29:36
AlienPrinceFromVenus

What is your view of yourself like as a nonbinary person?

I'm nonbinary, and I like to self analyze a lot. So I thought what the hell, being nonbinary is such an individual experience a lot of other thembos here probably self analyze a lot too. If you feel like rambling about your thoughts on your identity, or your experience as nonbinary feel free to do so here.

My ulterior motive obviously is that I wanna talk about my favourite subject; myself.

I am comfortable divulging that I was raised female and present in a way society would perceive as feminine. Most of the time. I happen to like the colour pink, rainbows and unicorns, glitter and fairy farts. That's just my aesthetic. But before I ever even had heard of the term nonbinary I was a teen who was incredibly uncomfortable with the thought that, as I was, the way my body was small and my face soft, I could never have passed as male, or had that specific type of androgynous air to myself.

I used to think androgyny was only one look. Lanky, shapeless vaguely masculine looking person. And I was a shorty with a round face and feminine thighs. Not exactly the pinnacle of masculinity.

I never felt excited or happy about growing breasts, and I still have no clue if it's related to my gender identity or the intense fetishization of breats in western society. Likely it's both.

But I grew up and my view of myself changed. I had learned what nonbinary means, and secretly I wanted to identify as such but I felt immense guilt over that desire. I questioned whether it was just because it seemed cool to me. If I was just trying to be even more of a special snowflake. I still liked clothes society perceived as feminine. I identified myself as a lesbian, which during that time had to me the inherent connotation of womanhood. A friend of mine eventually told me something like "there is no one look of androgyny".

After that I started thinking that if gender identity is a social construct, and if I'm always bitching about how annoying it is that things like skirts and glitter and pink balloons have to have gender attached to them, just because society decided so, then why am I abiding by those views? I stopped feeling guilty about wanting to identify as nonbinary. I feel nonbinary because the gender roles, the identities and the expectations society has, are toxic and stifling and I refuse to let that poison in my own identity. For me it's I guess about the philosophy I approach gender with.

There are still things I don't understand about myself and my gender. Like the issue of my breasts, silly as that sounds. I suppose I'm mildly dysphoric about them but the reason is unclear to me. Far as pronouns go my native language has gender neutral pronouns only so I don't care as much what my pronouns are. I think I still have a little guilt left over that's stopping me from asking to simply be referred to with they/them pronouns, so for now I just tell people to use whatever they fucking please :3

Aaah. I'm always oversharing huh. Well, it's fine, I'm ok with being open about this.

15.04.2020 20:29:36
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Freethinkerland
15.04.2020 20:44:11
Peg leg

Thanks for this forum post, it's nice to feel welcome :D

Personally, I almost always go by "he/him", but there are rare times when I switch over and feel like being more of a girl or being neither or being both--and it gets confusing. I'm never sure if I fit into the trans/nb community because it's always such a rare occurrence for me to feel that switch and it's always after I get inspired by some video of a cute girl or something where I'm like--"Gosh, I wish I could be cute like her!". So I dunno...I don't want to overstep into a community that might not be mine, you know? I'm not sure if being inspired like that is something part of my identity or if it's just me wanting to play dress up...Gah. 

I have very small features for the most part, so it's easy to switch back and forth and feel like I "belong" either way, even though I know that passing has nothing to do with validity it still feels...nice, to feel cis when I want to. I know I like feeling cute, no matter what gender I present as, so at least I have that worked out. And I know other people's opinions shouldn't matter to me, but...they do. They totally do. When a dude calls me cute, I can't help but feel 1000x more assured in myself. Wish I could feel that way all the time XD

15.04.2020 20:44:11
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15.04.2020 21:00:10
AlienPrinceFromVenus

@Peg leg

I have a similiar feeling about community. I don't think of myself as being part of the trans community because I just don't think my experience is accurate to that? I feel like I would just take space from trans people, while not being able to truly relate to their experience. I know there are trans nonbinary people though. I feel ok considering myself part of the nonbinary community by itself.

It's hard not to care about how others perceive you I think. Maybe I can word this in a really deep and philosophical way. Oh! Let's misquote neon genesis evangelion a bit!

There are three versions of us. The us that we present to the world, the us that the world sees, and the us that exists in the privacy of our mind.

The us that the world sees, of course you want the world to see you as you are? You want the us we present to the world and the us the world sees to match. I think that's why even if you're a person like me who despises gender alltogether, it hurts when the world still genders me. Most often it will gender me as a woman. Only my friends know that I'm nonbinary because I have told them. And I understand that the world can't just look at me and read my mind and know that I feel like both rejecting gender alltogether, and like I still have little fragments of feminity and masculinity making up the whole that I am. That's probably why I dislike gender as a social construct so much. If gender didn't exist I wouldn't have to hurt  over something like that.

15.04.2020 21:00:10
They/Them 
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Freethinkerland
15.04.2020 21:26:35
Peg leg

@ AlienPrinceFromVenus

You're right, and it just adds another level of sadness and embarrassment that the world doesn't accept those who go outside of gender norms usually. I want the world to think of me as a normal person, whose personality and thoughts are the forefront of myself, but it seems that people get one look at me and will judge who I am already. And I think that's something that happens to a lot of people, but it's something a lot of lgbtqa+ deal with no matter what. I don't want my queerness to be who I am--it's just part of who I am. But I feel like, as a dude, if I want to present feminine and cutesy then automatically I'm going to be put in a box. It sucks, I wish gender could be more free. And it's definitely better than it used to be, but it's still not to the point where it's something I can ignore in my head. :(


15.04.2020 21:26:35
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Freethinkerland
16.04.2020 01:15:32
eraserhead

for me being nonbinary is so hard to explain because i feel even so many of the words we've been given are binary. i don't fit in a box - i saw a post on tumblr that was like "no i'm not a girl no i'm not a boy yes i'm both" and that's it lol. it just feels beyond words, and nonbinary is the best one i have. the only other labels i solidly identify with are bisexual and gender-nonconforming - i suppose being nonbinary fits somewhere in both of those. i've had some pretty bad dysphoria since puberty, although a lot of it has to do with other people looking at me and seeing something i dont want them to see. can look in the mirror sometimes and think "wow my boobs look hot" but i don't trust anyone else to think that lol. pronoun wise i put they/them on stuff and generally refer to myself as they or he, but in the end i see them as another aspect of presentation, and i don't care what pronouns people use as long as they're not using them to gender me. 

it's made even more complicated by the fact that, presentation wise, i definitely go out of my way to present "weirdly". i genuinely like the clothes i wear, i like clashing patterns and bright colours and wearing styles that aren't "in" anymore, but part of it is me wanting to be in control of what people think of me. i've accepted that i'm not good at acting like everyone else, but ive now made it so when people think "oh they're... weird" it's because i want them to think that. im not trying to present as a girl or a guy or masculine or feminine, i'm presenting as me, you know? im plus size, so not exactly the "ideal" nonbinary person already, i'll never "pass" as a guy (tho i'd still like to), and accepting that and deciding that i dont need to pass as anything because i'm already nonbinary really helped.

honestly i love hearing about how other nonbinary people feel about their identity, so this is great! sorry if what i wrote doesn't make much sense - my gender just be like that lol


16.04.2020 01:15:32

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Freethinkerland
16.04.2020 03:40:00
Peg leg

@ eraserhead 

No it totally makes sense, I see where you're coming from! Personally I think that genderfluid is the best description I'll get, since it's basically...anything you want, whenever you want XD

16.04.2020 03:40:00
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Freethinkerland
16.04.2020 03:42:09
eraserhead

@peg leg 

oh i 1000% get that, if i was to ever actually choose a label more specific than nonbinary it would be genderfluid bc youre right its anything you want whenever you want! 

16.04.2020 03:42:09

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Reasonopia
16.04.2020 14:44:56
AlienPrinceFromVenus

Well on the topic of fluidity, I think I tend to switch between feeling genderless and hyperfeminine or hypermasculine. It's like, sometimes I'm in a mood to be either cute or assertive, and both of those moods feel like I'm wearing a gender as a costume. It's fun those times because it's my choice. I guess recently the two modes have become more of a single one though. Like I no longer have exclusively masculine moods, I just dress up really feminine and end up acting in a way that's domineering and I enjoy the dissonance that comes from that. Like wearing a sailor skirt and manspreading. Watching Dorian Electra's music videos has made me want to experiment with skirts and eyeliner moustaches...

Using behaviours society recognizes as gendered and then fucking around with them, that's probably what it is.

16.04.2020 14:44:56
They/Them 

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