Serious talk / Reputation points helping thread

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Serious talk / Reputation points helping thread

Category
Haute Coffee Shop

Posts
66

Created
02.11.2023

Author
Blecky89

Blecky89

Level 234
Status: Citizen
Sex Appeal: 10775166
Reputation: 759855
Posts: 25858

33 0

02.11.2023 08:25:34
Blecky89

It has come to my notice that time from time we want to talk about more serious topics that don't aligne with the intentions of original Rep help thread.
So this is your place to discuss more serious and not so pleasant topics. Kind reminder thought let's follow forum rules, keep discusions respectfull and no explicit content.
Just like in original thread don't forget to thumb up.

02.11.2023 08:25:34

alexa pro

Level 73
Status: Senator
Sex Appeal: 306678
Reputation: 88739
Posts: 1196

18 0

02.11.2023 16:01:13
alexa pro

thank you blecky!!!!

02.11.2023 16:01:13

juno

he/hymn

like forum posts!!

Katrynah

Level 244
Status: Minister of Foreign Affairs
Sex Appeal: 12769394
Reputation: 181171
Posts: 2272

36 8

02.11.2023 16:37:20
Katrynah

Moved from "Reputation points helper thread", originally posted at 2023-11-01 23:15:12

in this last week alone, israel bombed multiple refugee camps (jabalia, al brajj, jenin, to name a few), bombed the Turkish hospital which possessed the only machines for treating cancer patients (thus destroying/disabling the equipment), and opened fire on a UN bus of palestinians attempting to move from the north to the south of gaza all while settler violence escalates in the west bank. it seems that no matter where they go nor what they do, the palestinans cannot escape. last time i presented the tragedies ongoing in this thread, i was met with a call for "lighter news", so to lighten this news ive omitted the body counts and horrific images that have come about.

02.11.2023 16:37:20

☆*- кαтяуиαн -* ☆

alexa pro

Level 73
Status: Senator
Sex Appeal: 306678
Reputation: 88739
Posts: 1196

23 4

02.11.2023 16:38:19
alexa pro

Moved from "Reputation points helper thread", originally posted at 2023-11-01 23:21:52

thank you for informing us, such a tragedy that's happening right before our eyes

02.11.2023 16:38:19

juno

he/hymn

like forum posts!!

morguegirl

Level 174
Status: Citizen
Sex Appeal: 4206910
Reputation: 113887
Posts: 1691

30 6

02.11.2023 16:38:38
morguegirl

Moved from "Reputation points helper thread", originally posted at 2023-11-02 02:59:46

Katrynah wrote:

in this last week alone, israel bombed multiple refugee camps (jabalia, al brajj, jenin, to name a few), bombed the Turkish hospital which possessed the only machines for treating cancer patients (thus destroying/disabling the equipment), and opened fire on a UN bus of palestinians attempting to move from the north to the south of gaza all while settler violence escalates in the west bank. it seems that no matter where they go nor what they do, the palestinans cannot escape. last time i presented the tragedies ongoing in this thread, i was met with a call for "lighter news", so to lighten this news ive omitted the body counts and horrific images that have come about.

i've also been wanting to talk about what's going on, but i was scared of being banned or something, because in most places i feel silenced or attacked when i try to talk about it. we should be able to talk. today i saw on the news that the israeli police were attacking and arresting jews who are against the zionist regime. israel clearly doesn't care about its own people. it's not about "protecting themselves". it's surreal the way they victimize themselves to brainwash people into supporting them.

02.11.2023 16:38:38

Katrynah

Level 244
Status: Minister of Foreign Affairs
Sex Appeal: 12769394
Reputation: 181171
Posts: 2272

24 5

02.11.2023 16:42:46
Katrynah

Moved from "Reputation points helper thread", originally posted at 2023-11-02 03:59:01

some good news from gaza is that egypt has opened part of its border and is triaging refugees in need of medical care, so there's some light in the overwhelming grief. bad news is biden currently trying to push an israel aid package which'll cut funds from the IRS and possibly other government sectors. idk about my other americans in this thread, but i dont think i'll be able to vote for him come 2024

and ascelina i remember working closing shifts, but i was always too tired to stay up after. especially if i had an opening shift the next day, it felt like i took my apron off and immediately hit the pillow lol

02.11.2023 16:42:46

☆*- кαтяуиαн -* ☆

Susan Slutzky

Level 234
Status: Citizen
Sex Appeal: 10800629
Reputation: 208866
Posts: 3608

16 27

02.11.2023 16:44:50
Susan Slutzky

Moved from "Reputation points helper thread", originally posted at 2023-11-02 14:08:17

Katrynah, if you care so much about innocent lives, why don’t you ever mention the terrorist atrocities committed by Hamas, who began this war on October 7 by attacking, without warning, Israeli civilians who were attending an outdoor music festival? Women, children, entire families slaughtered, kidnapped and raped just because they were Jewish.

If you care so much about the people in Gaza, why do you not complain about how Hamas refuses to spend the considerable economic aid it receives on actually improving the living conditions of the citizens they govern? Or why they choose to put their military headquarters literally underneath a hospital to deliberately use civilians as human shields against Israeli counter-attacks?

I’m sorry but I’ve had just about enough of the antisemitic propaganda creeping into this forum. And if it continues, I will not remain silent.

02.11.2023 16:44:50

Pollyx

Level 125
Status: State Minister
Sex Appeal: 1548319
Reputation: 47877
Posts: 737

35 8

02.11.2023 17:04:58
Pollyx

Hi everyone! I know Janeze said to keep the topics more positive (in main rep thread) and I just noticed that in the hours it took me to compose this post, a new thread has been made, and I get that and see why that happened so I'm putting this in the new one. However, I do think it is important. I just wanted to distribute some resources for people who earnestly want to know more about what is going on in Palestine without the propaganda and elaborate campaign of misinformation produced by Israel. And there is a lot of propaganda, as Israel is a very powerful state supported by many powerful Western colonialist/imperialist powers (notably the US and the UK, though many others are included).

I would urge everyone, regardless of their opinion, to take a look at some of the resources I have provided if you have time. You might be surprised by what you find.

If Ximboland is a site which discusses and takes into account political issues (which it is, despite most of us ignoring that), this is well within the scope of the site. I think it's also important that people educate themselves so that they know this is not an issue of antisemitism (article contains many, many sources and is written by a Jewish person raised in Israel), but instead of colonialism. Here is another article about this same topic which explains the harm created TOWARDS Jews by framing anti-Zionism as the same thing as anti-Semitism, also written by a Jewish person, also containing sources. and Israel intentionally frames this as antisemitism because doing so helps defend their apartheid and genocide. Framing this as an issue of antisemitism actually only creates more hatred and violence against Muslims AND Jews, exacerbating an existing rise in antisemitism created by right-wing political movements (speaking about the US in particular). I have included a large variety of sources from many different organizations. Hopefully this will help everyone.

- A resource from Brown University covering much of the history of the Israeli Apartheid in Palestine

- A database from The Freedom Archives discussing the long-term history of this settler colonialism, genocide, and apartheid in general

- A series of academic articles provided for free which describe how Israel created Zionist propaganda to defend their existence as a settler state (why I say it's important to educate yourself in spite of mainstream media furthering this propaganda)

- Children make up half of Gaza's population. Children are also making up around half of the death count created by Israel's genocide. Just to go against what is shared in mainstream media, no, these children are not part of Hamas, and most of them graduate high school. To also go against the idea that Palestinians, Muslims, or anti-Zionists are blatantly anti-feminist

- Many people claim Palestine is uniquely homophobic. Here is an an article discussing one aspect of this that is true! But also, here is an article talking about the PM of Israel putting an extremely sexist, anti-LGBTQ, and right-wing politician in a place of power (in 2022!!!), as well as the effects of this action. Here is another article talking about homophobic sentiment in Israel, in some businesses and in the government. Also, here is an article talking about the Texas GOP (United States), which largely controls the state, embracing far-right anti-LGBTQ rhetoric. In case anyone doesn't know, the US also repealed Roe v. Wade in 2022, so I'm not sure we should really hold up the US, which allies with Israel, as some amazingly accepting world power. In fact, despite federal legality, 12 states in the US have not repealed their anti-sodomy laws which criminalize homosexuality, and Supreme Court justices have implied wanting to repeal Lawrence v. Texas, which made homosexuality legal federally. It's worth mentioning that while Palestine does have major problems with queerphobia, homosexuality is not illegal there. Notably also, here is an article discussing how Israel has blackmailed gay Palestinians into being informants. And here is an article from just under 2 weeks ago about queer Palestinians posting on Queering the Map in support of Palestine AND their gay identities. Here's an article talking about Zionist propaganda surrounding queer Palestinians. It also makes a great point about how the narrative told in a biased personal story is actually pretty common even in "progressive" nations such as the US, where I live. If you've read up on LGBT and specifically transgender rights in the US, the situation is really bad. Pot calling the kettle black, perhaps?

- An article discussing death tolls in Gaza and Israel, as well as the reliability of these sources. I want to emphasize in case it is not clearly obvious to everyone that I do not support anyone being killed. A major world power supported financially and militarily by the largest military powers in the world has numerous possible tactics to use to retrieve Hamas weaponry without bombing entire hospitals and refugee camps of innocent people. I cannot believe I have to say this.

- In fact, while we're on this topic, here is info about how Israel helped to create Hamas while shutting down the more secular Palestinian revolutionary organization, the PLO, through assassinations and other tactics. And here's more about that.

- 9,000+ Palestinians and counting have been killed in Gaza. One of my previous sources references death counts, and it is worth mentioning that Israel's sources for counting deaths are much more accurate to the number, and while the Health Ministry in Gaza has always been known to have accurate numbers, the chaos of the current situation means that death totals have likely been vastly underreported.

- More overall numbers, including Israeli casualties, so that no one can accuse me of not sharing this. The vast majority of the 1400 (DEPLORABLE OBVIOUSLY. NO ONE SHOULD DIE.) Israeli deaths occurred in the initial attack from Hamas.

- This Twitter thread lacks source links (but you can find the articles by searching keywords), but repeats many of the things I have sourced here. It takes less time to read if you don't have time to research, but also gives you less info, so kind of a trade. It was also made almost a month ago, before Israel bombed hospital and refugee camps, disconnected Gaza's internet, and 9000 people died.

- Here is another resource to read more current and past information about human rights violations and genocide perpetrated by Israel against Palestinians.

- And here is another resource which includes things you can do to help.
________

Additionally, here is some info about me for transparency:
- I live in the US, was born and raised here. I am white. Agnostic, not Jewish or Muslim. I am trans and bisexual, as far as the LGBT perspective goes. I have a graduate degree in the general field of health justice and health advocacy

- Anti-Zionist higher ed professionals and doctors I work with include Palestinians & Puerto Ricans, both victims of colonial powers, as well as Anti-Zionist Jews. Just sharing this info to express that access to academic information and detailed, accurate anthropological study often radicalizes people against Israel's apartheid and Zionism in general. As someone graduate educated I really want to emphasize that I know it is classist that this information is paywalled, but often it is not the choice of the people publishing. People outside of this environment rarely have access to the resources they need to develop an informed opinion.
______________
I will not be continuing this thread or topic here. I will not be arguing with anyone in DMs. I'm keeping a log of this comment, so if it gets deleted you are welcome to contact me on Discord (if you're on the XL Discord) for more info or to message me and receive a copy of this, though again, I will not discuss it. HOWEVER, if you have an issue with the validity of one of my sources and can provide info/sources as to why it is factually incorrect, please do so and I will look at what you've sent and edit my post.

02.11.2023 17:04:58

♥ Join Inventing Vogue, an official shop fashion design contest for all skill levels—winning designs will be created by current designers and added to the shop!! ♥
Here is my well-sourced educational forum post about Israel's apartheid and genocide of Palestinians on the Gaza Strip, please educate yourself or you may fall for propaganda!

Susan Slutzky

Level 234
Status: Citizen
Sex Appeal: 10800629
Reputation: 208866
Posts: 3608

12 31

02.11.2023 17:50:06
Susan Slutzky

Pollyx, you are entitled to hold whatever opinions you want. But if you’re just going to dump all that stuff in the thread and then refuse to engage in actual discussion or defend your statements here from criticism, then I really couldn’t care less what you have to say about this subject.

Furthermore, I don’t need to be lectured about what constitutes antisemitism. If someone is upset about casualties in Gaza, but can’t manage to say a single word about the worst mass killing of Jews since the Holocaust, the message is crystal clear.

02.11.2023 17:50:06

Pollyx

Level 125
Status: State Minister
Sex Appeal: 1548319
Reputation: 47877
Posts: 737

36 6

02.11.2023 18:08:26
Pollyx

Hi Susan! My reasoning for not engaging in further discussion is not because I can't defend my statements, though I actually don't need to defend their validity because I provided sources for everything I claimed. I should have actually said that I don't want to debate whether or not human life is valuable or whether or not this constitutes genocide, because I fundamentally believe that the massacre of both Palestinians and Jews is abhorrent and must stop. I provided a lot of information as to why Israel's government is actually to blame for this long term (they created Hamas in an attempt to quell secular dissent against their colonial regime), why Israel's defenders benefit from antisemitism, etc. My goal was not to argue! My goal is to provide information people may not know or have access to. I gave a lot of information that shows why my perspective here is fundamentally pro-Jew and pro-Muslim while also being anti-Zionist, and why these are not incompatible ideas.

It's not that I'm afraid to debate, but instead that I don't think it will help anything to debate with people who aren't willing to engage with factual, researched information. You say I dumped things here because you didn't read what I shared, and aren't interested in doing so. That's okay, that's your choice, but that's also why I don't want to debate with you. I'm interested in communicating with people who are working with legitimate information and are well-informed instead of being motivated by propaganda. Otherwise, it's just a waste of everyone's time and emotional energy and in general, I don't think people want to fight on this site. If you had read what I shared, maybe you would understand where I'm coming from and would not be misrepresenting my beliefs as being antisemitic or condoning the deaths of Jewish people. I'm not Jewish, I will give you that! That's not my life or history, and is a detail I freely shared. But all of the sources I shared that talk about why anti-Zionism =/= antisemitism were written by Jewish people, including many who have lived in or were born in Israel. Many of my sources go into this in great detail.

I hope that clears things up. I should have provided more info in my original post about WHY I don't want to engage with argument, so that was on me. I would also welcome anyone who has legitimate alternate sources that show both sides (as mine did) to share those as well. I hope this can help everyone understand things a little better, as well as why I said I did not want to engage in dialogue. I actually meant I do not want to engage in uninformed dialogue. If you read through all of my sources and still disagree or think I'm missing something, feel free to DM me.

I always want to understand new perspectives and would love to have the chance to help other people understand this issue more fully. I shouldn't have phrased things the way I did and I want to make sure people know I'm not trying to just stop people from telling me I'm wrong, you can do that all day if you want. I just only want to talk to people who are educating themselves before jumping into the discussion. I worked very hard to include sources that talk about both perspectives and are in general not propagandistic, but that's sometimes unavoidable, so again, feel free to give feedback if you think one of my sources is unreliable.

02.11.2023 18:08:26

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